Hello Colleagues,
I do not pretend to understand all aspects of the collateral source issue, as it is an evolving one. However, my 2 cents would be… I strongly believe the life care plan must stay true to it's purpose of providing the cost of obtaining the goods and services in today's market.
I am hearing in this discussion that some states are saying "collateral sources must be considered in settlements," but, is anyone saying they are being told, "collateral sources must be considered in the life care plan?"
What is done with the life care plan after it is produced is up to the attorney. It is processed according to the law. For example, they send it to the economist to calculate inflation or to a Medicare set-aside specialist. There may need to be a specialty for evaluating what would be covered by the Affordable Care Act coverage, but, I am not that specialist. Unless the law is saying the "life care plan" must consider collateral sources, I would suggest that we consider keeping the life care plan pure to today's market value, and yet accept there may need to be another step, by another consultant (the attorney coordinates), in order to provide a final product usable to the court. I look forward to learning more…
See you in Phoenix!
Amy Johnson Mackenzie, PhD, RN
Certified Life Care Planner
3602 Canyon Creek Circle
Tyler, Texas 75707
(903) 595-6777 Phone
(903) 595-6779 Fax
amy@johnsonclcp.comJohnsonCLCP.com
Original Message------
Hello to Jurisdictional believers,
The only way I can see that one can answer this concern is in this way:
One would need to take a sample of say 10 discounted items.... and say these are all possible and also show say 10 companies that did not provide discounts and tell the jury, if you feel the evaluee will luck out and find the company with the discount then that would be the answer...but this is a very weak argument, there is no reliability, will the discount still be there next week, next month, or at all?... but that is what the jurisdictional believers are saying - we must follow something that is not guaranteed and say with our righteous tone of voice...you must find a discount figure, because our religious & political state says you must. OK at this time, on this date there was a discount. (whats wrong with this statement - the evaluee gets the raw end of the deal - we will all become defense experts no unbiased experts - because religion and politics rule. And again the good name of rehabilitation will be used as a claims management tool - how nice - it has a nice ring to it and my gosh the LCP professional said it with his/ her integrity just glistening on their halo.
Next provide 10 examples of what one party of the state did with medical concerns and find 10 items where the other party impacted medical concerns. Jurisdictional believers want an answer. What if the State changes their congressional districts and actually makes gerrymandering not legal - at present there is a push for this action in States across the USA. I live in Michigan and the League of Women Voters is having 30 town meetings regarding gerrymendering through out the state this Fall. Do you want to be on the side of the Jurisdictional Believers that say we must make a choice. I say no. "We can all take a stand and say we will not take part in this" There was a time when blacks had to sit in the back of the bus, children worked in factories, women were not allowed to do certain jobs, ....there were many wrong laws made by politicians influenced by unsavory, or just plain ignorant folks that wanted their views to be heard over doing the right thing. We know what the right thing is, why would you want to throw that out. This is no different than a labor movement...we need to do the right thing as a group and not give in to baloney thinking.
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Ronald Smolarski
Director
ron@beaconrehab.com
Ann Arbor, MI United States
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Original Message:
Sent: 08-10-2015 16:00
From: Karen Preston
Subject: Collateral Sources in life care plans
So are you suggesting that we ignore jurisdictional requirements? How, specifically, would you present your costs when you know that the court requires different costs? I am struggling with comments that suggest that we set our own rules when, in fact, we have chosen to play in someone else's setting. "Market value" is not ours alone to define.
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Karen Preston, FIALCP
Consultant
rnsconsult@aol.com
Sacramento, CA United States
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Original Message:
Sent: 08-08-2015 05:49
From: Kent Arnold Jayne
Subject: Collateral Sources in life care plans
I agree with Ron. We evaluate needs. We evaluate the market value of those needs. As life care planners, we must resist becoming part of a political agenda, even though we are under tremendous pressure to surrender to the dark side, disguised coyly as efficiency.
All market prices of goods and services, by definition, rest on the best perceptions of buyers and sellers, of the risks associated with the research, development, production and distribution of the item in question. This is why market prices represent an equilibrium between the forces of risk and the forces of demand to produce that product or service.
Bond price and yields in the market are a perfect example of this equilibrium. No one will argue that price of a bond will not decrease in the face of inflation risk, thus increasing the yield represented by its market derived interest rate. That the price and the yield of any commodity is subject to the same market forces, dare I say it as a socialist, is inevitably true.
The market will continue to shift costs based on the perceptions of buyers and sellers. We cannot easily predict which way costs will shift in the future, but the market price today represents the best collective human prediction of that shifting. Politics, greed, and the perception of morality will continue to shift. Collateral sources are simply a force in future cost shifting,which will be priced into the market after the current wave of cost shifting has run its course, and the new wave of cost shifting enlightens the minds of those in power to the belief that they can produce a favorable outcome for themselves based on whatever cause celebre possesses their greedy little egos at the time.
Collateral source discounts do not change the cost of an item, they simply shift it to someone else, resulting in a cascade of reciprocal shifting. Never forget, TNSTAAFL. (There's no such thing as a free lunch).
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Kent Arnold Jayne
President
kentjayne@sprynet.com
Cedar Rapids, IA United States
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Original Message:
Sent: 08-08-2015 01:32
From: Ronald Smolarski
Subject: Collateral Sources in life care plans
So how does one prove that an evaluee will receive a discount that is found by the LCPer? How does a LCPer guarantee that the present State political government will allow for services. As an example isn't places like Texas, Louisiana, North Carolina trying to prevent women''s health care because it's against their political or religious thinking? Why would a LCPer want to be part of a political or religious debate?
Ronald Smolarski
Director
ron@beaconrehab.com
Ann Arbor, MI United States
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Original Message:
Sent: 08-07-2015 14:57
From: David Stewart
Subject: Collateral Sources in life care plans
Collateral sources may be considered in the context of med mal.