Discussion: View Thread

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

The subtle, yet critical, missing elements in this discussion are changes in the BLS ORS definition of Light Work. ORS increased the upper limit of Light work to 25 lbs. ORS also omits any mention of the involvement of upper or lower extremities in its definition. Sedentary for ORS includes less than or equal to 1/3 of the day Standing.

In the DOT - Revised Handbook for Analyzing Jobs (RHAJ), there are several exceptions in the definition of Physical Demand Light - See https://skilltran.com/rhaj/rhaj12.pdf - page 12-2. Here are the key missing elements missing from consideration in the current ORS definition of Light Work:

"Even though the weight lifted may be only a negligible amount, a job should be rated Light Work:
(1) when it requires walking or standing to a significant degree; or 
(2) when it requires sitting most of the time but entails pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls; or 
(3) when the job requires working at a production rate pace entailing the constant pushing or pulling of materials even though the weight of those materials is negligible.
NOTE: The constant stress and strain of maintaining a production rate pace, especially in an industrial setting, can be and is physically demanding of a worker even though the amount of force exerted is negligible."

So what we have here is a different definition for Light Work by ORS that ignores (so far) the use of hand or foot controls. It is completely unknown what SSA will choose to do, given that they have not yet even formally recognized the ORS survey as an authoritative source of occupational information.

I would encourage IARP to discuss these operational definition differences with SSA. It was my understanding that SSA allowed the change up to 25 pounds for Light Work at ORS request. But completely unknown is whether the use of hand and/or foot controls should continue to be considered part of the revised ORS definition of Light work. The data has been captured in the ORS, but it is not factored into the published ORS definition of Light work. This missing "pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls" element figures significantly into occupations involving significant amounts of driving a vehicle and even into the production sector where machines require multiple extremities to operate or control.

Of the 477 SOC Groups (of 848 civilian SOCs) found in the Final Second Wave data set, there are 449 SOC Groups in which some degree of use of foot or leg controls is required. So this is a significant variable that should somehow be factored into how SSA chooses to treat this aspect of the ORS definition of Light work.

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

The subtle, yet critical, missing elements in this discussion are changes in the BLS ORS definition of Light Work. ORS increased the upper limit of Light work to 25 lbs. ORS also omits any mention of the involvement of upper or lower extremities in its definition. Sedentary for ORS includes less than or equal to 1/3 of the day Standing.

In the DOT - Revised Handbook for Analyzing Jobs (RHAJ), there are several exceptions in the definition of Physical Demand Light - See https://skilltran.com/rhaj/rhaj12.pdf - page 12-2. Here are the key missing elements missing from consideration in the current ORS definition of Light Work:

"Even though the weight lifted may be only a negligible amount, a job should be rated Light Work: (1) when it requires walking or standing to a significant degree; or  (2) when it requires sitting most of the time but entails pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls; or  (3) when the job requires working at a production rate pace entailing the constant pushing or pulling of materials even though the weight of those materials is negligible. NOTE: The constant stress and strain of maintaining a production rate pace, especially in an industrial setting, can be and is physically demanding of a worker even though the amount of force exerted is negligible."

So what we have here is a different definition for Light Work by ORS that ignores (so far) the use of hand or foot controls. It is completely unknown what SSA will choose to do, given that they have not yet even formally recognized the ORS survey as an authoritative source of occupational information.

I would encourage IARP to discuss these operational definition differences with SSA. It was my understanding that SSA allowed the change up to 25 pounds for Light Work at ORS request. But completely unknown is whether the use of hand and/or foot controls should continue to be considered part of the revised ORS definition of Light work. The data has been captured in the ORS, but it is not factored into the published ORS definition of Light work. This missing "pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls" element figures significantly into occupations involving significant amounts of driving a vehicle and even into the production sector where machines require multiple extremities to operate or control.

Of the 477 SOC Groups (of 848 civilian SOCs) found in the Final Second Wave data set, there are 449 SOC Groups in which some degree of use of foot or leg controls is required. So this is a significant variable that should somehow be factored into how SSA chooses to treat this aspect of the ORS definition of Light work.

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

I disagree. Go back to the source document - The Revised Handbook for Analyzing Jobs - Chapter 12, page 12-3. Medium Work was defined as "Exerting 20 to 50 pounds of force occasionally, or 10-25 pounds of force frequently, or greater than negligible up to 10 pounds of force constantly to move objects. Physical demand requirements are in excess of Light."

There was not a gap to fill. My understanding is that BLS suggested this change to SSA since Negligible to 10 lbs, 11 lbs. to 25 lbs, 26 lbs. to 50 lbs., 51 lbs. to 100 lbs, and >100 lbs. seemed like more consistent/even ranges to capture and report.

Omission of the use of hand or foot controls by SSA in its definition is one thing, but the RHAJ clearly defined for the job analysts what they were to observe, collect, and report in building the DOT. This included the very clear statement that Light work could include "sitting most of the time but entails pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls." As a result, the assignment of every single non-managerial occupation with Work Field 013 Transporting is rated at Light or higher, with exception of their misclassification of Escort Vehicle Drivers as the only Sedentary occupation in this code group involving actual driving. See my thoughts on this misclassification here: https://skilltran.com/index.php/support-area/documentation/266-escort-vehicle-driver

What chafes me the most about this whole, barely half complete ORS project is not only the dollars spent and time elapsed but also the complete lack of transparency on the part of SSA. SSA holds itself out as "building a new Occupational Information System (OIS)". Just where did they gain their insights/experience into how to build an OIS, yet alone collect the data essentially without the continuing guidance from the stellar panel of blue ribbon professionals assembled by Dr. Barros-Bailey in the Occupational Information Development Advisory Panel (OIDAP). The OIDAP panel included phenomenal contributions by its professional representation across a wide range of Industrial-Organizational and Educational Psychologists, Rehabilitation Medicine, Occupational Medicine, Private Rehabilitation Practitioners, Psychologists, Long Term Disability insurance, Disability Compensation, Physical Therapy, Research Psychology/Psychometry, Performance and HR Management, Psychiatry, and even an ALJ! Yet this committee was disbanded (for strictly partisan political reasons) before it completed its critical work on what we now know as the ORS mental-cognitive factors. 

SSA engaged the economists from the National Compensation Survey group to see if they could collect and report on the needed factors. Of course they agreed to do the work, proceeded down a sampling path I twice cautioned against in 2014 (see my history of warning comments then and more recently.) After 3 years of First Wave data collection, no mental cognitive data could be reported due to poor wording of their questions in a way that respondents could not reply. So now, five years later, we do have considerably better worded mental cognitive factors that finally have reportable data, but still for barely just half of the SOC groups. And there are no definitions for the tasks performed within each of the reported SOC groups. Why is there no reporting of something as basic as the task statements collected? How about disclosure of the number of respondents used to report these ratings and the industries (3-4 digit NAICS level) covered? This is statistical reporting at its most basic levels. Missing so far. 

It continues to concern me that very little independent inspiration, insight and particularly outside oversight has been sought or brought to SSA in this very lengthy and expensive data collection. It feels like SSA is intentionally slow walking this whole process to avoid having to completely abandon their existing cocoon of policy, rules, precedents and regulation. Much is also likely due to the unfortunate habit of not having (until fairly recently) a permanent commissioner. 

Nonetheless, fresh data builds new insights into what it takes to perform 477 SOC Groups - about 56% of way through the 848 civilian SOC occupations. 

The subtle, yet critical, missing elements in this discussion are changes in the BLS ORS definition of Light Work. ORS increased the upper limit of Light work to 25 lbs. ORS also omits any mention of the involvement of upper or lower extremities in its definition. Sedentary for ORS includes less than or equal to 1/3 of the day Standing.

In the DOT - Revised Handbook for Analyzing Jobs (RHAJ), there are several exceptions in the definition of Physical Demand Light - See https://skilltran.com/rhaj/rhaj12.pdf - page 12-2. Here are the key missing elements missing from consideration in the current ORS definition of Light Work:

"Even though the weight lifted may be only a negligible amount, a job should be rated Light Work: (1) when it requires walking or standing to a significant degree; or  (2) when it requires sitting most of the time but entails pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls; or  (3) when the job requires working at a production rate pace entailing the constant pushing or pulling of materials even though the weight of those materials is negligible. NOTE: The constant stress and strain of maintaining a production rate pace, especially in an industrial setting, can be and is physically demanding of a worker even though the amount of force exerted is negligible."

So what we have here is a different definition for Light Work by ORS that ignores (so far) the use of hand or foot controls. It is completely unknown what SSA will choose to do, given that they have not yet even formally recognized the ORS survey as an authoritative source of occupational information.

I would encourage IARP to discuss these operational definition differences with SSA. It was my understanding that SSA allowed the change up to 25 pounds for Light Work at ORS request. But completely unknown is whether the use of hand and/or foot controls should continue to be considered part of the revised ORS definition of Light work. The data has been captured in the ORS, but it is not factored into the published ORS definition of Light work. This missing "pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls" element figures significantly into occupations involving significant amounts of driving a vehicle and even into the production sector where machines require multiple extremities to operate or control.

Of the 477 SOC Groups (of 848 civilian SOCs) found in the Final Second Wave data set, there are 449 SOC Groups in which some degree of use of foot or leg controls is required. So this is a significant variable that should somehow be factored into how SSA chooses to treat this aspect of the ORS definition of Light work.

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

I disagree. Go back to the source document - The Revised Handbook for Analyzing Jobs - Chapter 12, page 12-3. Medium Work was defined as "Exerting 20 to 50 pounds of force occasionally, or 10-25 pounds of force frequently, or greater than negligible up to 10 pounds of force constantly to move objects. Physical demand requirements are in excess of Light."

There was not a gap to fill. My understanding is that BLS suggested this change to SSA since Negligible to 10 lbs, 11 lbs. to 25 lbs, 26 lbs. to 50 lbs., 51 lbs. to 100 lbs, and >100 lbs. seemed like more consistent/even ranges to capture and report.

Omission of the use of hand or foot controls by SSA in its definition is one thing, but the RHAJ clearly defined for the job analysts what they were to observe, collect, and report in building the DOT. This included the very clear statement that Light work could include "sitting most of the time but entails pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls." As a result, the assignment of every single non-managerial occupation with Work Field 013 Transporting is rated at Light or higher, with exception of their misclassification of Escort Vehicle Drivers as the only Sedentary occupation in this code group involving actual driving. See my thoughts on this misclassification here: https://skilltran.com/index.php/support-area/documentation/266-escort-vehicle-driver

What chafes me the most about this whole, barely half complete ORS project is not only the dollars spent and time elapsed but also the complete lack of transparency on the part of SSA. SSA holds itself out as "building a new Occupational Information System (OIS)". Just where did they gain their insights/experience into how to build an OIS, yet alone collect the data essentially without the continuing guidance from the stellar panel of blue ribbon professionals assembled by Dr. Barros-Bailey in the Occupational Information Development Advisory Panel (OIDAP). The OIDAP panel included phenomenal contributions by its professional representation across a wide range of Industrial-Organizational and Educational Psychologists, Rehabilitation Medicine, Occupational Medicine, Private Rehabilitation Practitioners, Psychologists, Long Term Disability insurance, Disability Compensation, Physical Therapy, Research Psychology/Psychometry, Performance and HR Management, Psychiatry, and even an ALJ! Yet this committee was disbanded (for strictly partisan political reasons) before it completed its critical work on what we now know as the ORS mental-cognitive factors. 

SSA engaged the economists from the National Compensation Survey group to see if they could collect and report on the needed factors. Of course they agreed to do the work, proceeded down a sampling path I twice cautioned against in 2014 (see my history of warning comments then and more recently.) After 3 years of First Wave data collection, no mental cognitive data could be reported due to poor wording of their questions in a way that respondents could not reply. So now, five years later, we do have considerably better worded mental cognitive factors that finally have reportable data, but still for barely just half of the SOC groups. And there are no definitions for the tasks performed within each of the reported SOC groups. Why is there no reporting of something as basic as the task statements collected? How about disclosure of the number of respondents used to report these ratings and the industries (3-4 digit NAICS level) covered? This is statistical reporting at its most basic levels. Missing so far. 

It continues to concern me that very little independent inspiration, insight and particularly outside oversight has been sought or brought to SSA in this very lengthy and expensive data collection. It feels like SSA is intentionally slow walking this whole process to avoid having to completely abandon their existing cocoon of policy, rules, precedents and regulation. Much is also likely due to the unfortunate habit of not having (until fairly recently) a permanent commissioner. 

Nonetheless, fresh data builds new insights into what it takes to perform 477 SOC Groups - about 56% of way through the 848 civilian SOC occupations. 

The subtle, yet critical, missing elements in this discussion are changes in the BLS ORS definition of Light Work. ORS increased the upper limit of Light work to 25 lbs. ORS also omits any mention of the involvement of upper or lower extremities in its definition. Sedentary for ORS includes less than or equal to 1/3 of the day Standing.

In the DOT - Revised Handbook for Analyzing Jobs (RHAJ), there are several exceptions in the definition of Physical Demand Light - See https://skilltran.com/rhaj/rhaj12.pdf - page 12-2. Here are the key missing elements missing from consideration in the current ORS definition of Light Work:

"Even though the weight lifted may be only a negligible amount, a job should be rated Light Work: (1) when it requires walking or standing to a significant degree; or  (2) when it requires sitting most of the time but entails pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls; or  (3) when the job requires working at a production rate pace entailing the constant pushing or pulling of materials even though the weight of those materials is negligible. NOTE: The constant stress and strain of maintaining a production rate pace, especially in an industrial setting, can be and is physically demanding of a worker even though the amount of force exerted is negligible."

So what we have here is a different definition for Light Work by ORS that ignores (so far) the use of hand or foot controls. It is completely unknown what SSA will choose to do, given that they have not yet even formally recognized the ORS survey as an authoritative source of occupational information.

I would encourage IARP to discuss these operational definition differences with SSA. It was my understanding that SSA allowed the change up to 25 pounds for Light Work at ORS request. But completely unknown is whether the use of hand and/or foot controls should continue to be considered part of the revised ORS definition of Light work. The data has been captured in the ORS, but it is not factored into the published ORS definition of Light work. This missing "pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls" element figures significantly into occupations involving significant amounts of driving a vehicle and even into the production sector where machines require multiple extremities to operate or control.

Of the 477 SOC Groups (of 848 civilian SOCs) found in the Final Second Wave data set, there are 449 SOC Groups in which some degree of use of foot or leg controls is required. So this is a significant variable that should somehow be factored into how SSA chooses to treat this aspect of the ORS definition of Light work.

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

The subtle, yet critical, missing elements in this discussion are changes in the BLS ORS definition of Light Work. ORS increased the upper limit of Light work to 25 lbs. ORS also omits any mention of the involvement of upper or lower extremities in its definition. Sedentary for ORS includes less than or equal to 1/3 of the day Standing.

In the DOT - Revised Handbook for Analyzing Jobs (RHAJ), there are several exceptions in the definition of Physical Demand Light - See https://skilltran.com/rhaj/rhaj12.pdf - page 12-2. Here are the key missing elements missing from consideration in the current ORS definition of Light Work:

"Even though the weight lifted may be only a negligible amount, a job should be rated Light Work:
(1) when it requires walking or standing to a significant degree; or 
(2) when it requires sitting most of the time but entails pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls; or 
(3) when the job requires working at a production rate pace entailing the constant pushing or pulling of materials even though the weight of those materials is negligible.
NOTE: The constant stress and strain of maintaining a production rate pace, especially in an industrial setting, can be and is physically demanding of a worker even though the amount of force exerted is negligible."

So what we have here is a different definition for Light Work by ORS that ignores (so far) the use of hand or foot controls. It is completely unknown what SSA will choose to do, given that they have not yet even formally recognized the ORS survey as an authoritative source of occupational information.

I would encourage IARP to discuss these operational definition differences with SSA. It was my understanding that SSA allowed the change up to 25 pounds for Light Work at ORS request. But completely unknown is whether the use of hand and/or foot controls should continue to be considered part of the revised ORS definition of Light work. The data has been captured in the ORS, but it is not factored into the published ORS definition of Light work. This missing "pushing or pulling of arm or leg controls" element figures significantly into occupations involving significant amounts of driving a vehicle and even into the production sector where machines require multiple extremities to operate or control.

Of the 477 SOC Groups (of 848 civilian SOCs) found in the Final Second Wave data set, there are 449 SOC Groups in which some degree of use of foot or leg controls is required. So this is a significant variable that should somehow be factored into how SSA chooses to treat this aspect of the ORS definition of Light work.

It is a while since I did work with the trucking industry. I never heard of "no touch" trucking jobs.  There was what I recall as "hook and drop".  That is, the driver never has anything to do with the trailer load. They simply back the truck to the trailer, connect the hoses from truck to trailer and turn a crank to hook the trailer to the bed of the trailer hitch on the truck. All very easy and less than 10 pounds of force (I had to measure that when doing job analysis), if the equipment was clean and lubricated (not always so easy). At destination, it is the reverse.  Disconnect the hoses and turn the crank to release the trailer hitch. The driver had to do this for the same reason a pilot is supposed to inspect their plane before flying; to ensure that it is properly and safely done. I rated these jobs as Light as performed given the climbing in and out the truck, standing to connect the hoses and to turn that crank. Everything else was sedentary – that is driving to and from destinations.

 

That's what I recall. Would that be the "no touch"  being referred to here or are we talking about self-driving trucks and no labor costs for the trucking companies while we drive on our highways with these AI driven monsters around us?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

Excellent stuff, Connie. The concept of a truck driving job being "sedentary", other than in body position, but as in <10# lift/force/exert, is nonsensical. Any attorney would easily be able to poke holes in such an opinion with obvious questions, supplied by their expert or client. The incidence of "sedentary" truck driver in ORS data would likely be nil had JA of actual workers been done. Dang, those pesky workers who actually do the work! They are always so able and willing to describe in excruciating detail, from years of experience, exactly why and how what us college boys and girls think is sometimes just plain wrong. When something seems crazy, it is often crazy like a fox.

The year it was decided DOT would not be continued a joint venture between IARP and ABVE to do our own ought to have been initiated. There are thousands of us to divvy it up. Why rely upon government non-experts to provide THE resource to experts about stuff we are already experts about. Would experts do such in other professions?

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It has been a few years since I did an on-site JA for a truck driver, but I recall from ergonomics and other training in the past that the force required just to pull one's own body weight up in order to enter most tractor-trailer rigs is at least at the Medium level. Federal regs say the following:

Distance between steps. The distance between steps, up to and including the door sill step, shall provide any person a stable resting position which can be sustained without body motion and by exerting no more arm force than 35 percent of the person's body weight per grasp during all stages of entry and exit. This criterion applies to intermediate positions as well as transition between intermediate positions above ground level.   

Find citation at: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-III/subchapter-B/part-399/subpart-L/section-399.207

Do the math with even a 150 pound driver (most drivers are probably heavier), and you already are at more than 50 pounds. 

I often hear drivers mention doing no-touch driving, but they still have to get into and out of the truck or climb on it to check or secure loads. Unless they have a special lift to access the cab or other areas of the truck that must be checked, they are exerting more than Light force. 

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It has been a few years since I did an on-site JA for a truck driver, but I recall from ergonomics and other training in the past that the force required just to pull one's own body weight up in order to enter most tractor-trailer rigs is at least at the Medium level. Federal regs say the following:

Distance between steps. The distance between steps, up to and including the door sill step, shall provide any person a stable resting position which can be sustained without body motion and by exerting no more arm force than 35 percent of the person's body weight per grasp during all stages of entry and exit. This criterion applies to intermediate positions as well as transition between intermediate positions above ground level.   

Find citation at: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-III/subchapter-B/part-399/subpart-L/section-399.207

Do the math with even a 150 pound driver (most drivers are probably heavier), and you already are at more than 50 pounds. 

I often hear drivers mention doing no-touch driving, but they still have to get into and out of the truck or climb on it to check or secure loads. Unless they have a special lift to access the cab or other areas of the truck that must be checked, they are exerting more than Light force. 

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It has been a few years since I did an on-site JA for a truck driver, but I recall from ergonomics and other training in the past that the force required just to pull one's own body weight up in order to enter most tractor-trailer rigs is at least at the Medium level. Federal regs say the following:

Distance between steps. The distance between steps, up to and including the door sill step, shall provide any person a stable resting position which can be sustained without body motion and by exerting no more arm force than 35 percent of the person's body weight per grasp during all stages of entry and exit. This criterion applies to intermediate positions as well as transition between intermediate positions above ground level.   

Find citation at: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-III/subchapter-B/part-399/subpart-L/section-399.207

Do the math with even a 150 pound driver (most drivers are probably heavier), and you already are at more than 50 pounds. 

I often hear drivers mention doing no-touch driving, but they still have to get into and out of the truck or climb on it to check or secure loads. Unless they have a special lift to access the cab or other areas of the truck that must be checked, they are exerting more than Light force. 

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

It has been a few years since I did an on-site JA for a truck driver, but I recall from ergonomics and other training in the past that the force required just to pull one's own body weight up in order to enter most tractor-trailer rigs is at least at the Medium level. Federal regs say the following:

Distance between steps. The distance between steps, up to and including the door sill step, shall provide any person a stable resting position which can be sustained without body motion and by exerting no more arm force than 35 percent of the person's body weight per grasp during all stages of entry and exit. This criterion applies to intermediate positions as well as transition between intermediate positions above ground level.   

Find citation at: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-III/subchapter-B/part-399/subpart-L/section-399.207

Do the math with even a 150 pound driver (most drivers are probably heavier), and you already are at more than 50 pounds. 

I often hear drivers mention doing no-touch driving, but they still have to get into and out of the truck or climb on it to check or secure loads. Unless they have a special lift to access the cab or other areas of the truck that must be checked, they are exerting more than Light force. 

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

Ha!   I thought that this discussion was going a bit far as we started by discussing only hook and drop trucking. Now you raise the question of putting tire chains on the trucks in winter. I have seen that done. Yes, I think the ergonomic term for that task is "arduous". 😊

 

It is my understanding that many northern states have banned tire chains and cleats because they tear up the highways. It makes trucking so much more exciting in the winter snowstorms. We have all seen the images of semi-tractor trailer trucks careening out of control on the highways in the reporting of snowstorm conditions.  Maybe driverless AI trucking will cure that?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

It has been a few years since I did an on-site JA for a truck driver, but I recall from ergonomics and other training in the past that the force required just to pull one's own body weight up in order to enter most tractor-trailer rigs is at least at the Medium level. Federal regs say the following:

Distance between steps. The distance between steps, up to and including the door sill step, shall provide any person a stable resting position which can be sustained without body motion and by exerting no more arm force than 35 percent of the person's body weight per grasp during all stages of entry and exit. This criterion applies to intermediate positions as well as transition between intermediate positions above ground level.   

Find citation at: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-III/subchapter-B/part-399/subpart-L/section-399.207

Do the math with even a 150 pound driver (most drivers are probably heavier), and you already are at more than 50 pounds. 

I often hear drivers mention doing no-touch driving, but they still have to get into and out of the truck or climb on it to check or secure loads. Unless they have a special lift to access the cab or other areas of the truck that must be checked, they are exerting more than Light force. 

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

Tire chains: A state-by-state requirement guide - TheTrucker.com

Ha!   I thought that this discussion was going a bit far as we started by discussing only hook and drop trucking. Now you raise the question of putting tire chains on the trucks in winter. I have seen that done. Yes, I think the ergonomic term for that task is "arduous". 😊

 

It is my understanding that many northern states have banned tire chains and cleats because they tear up the highways. It makes trucking so much more exciting in the winter snowstorms. We have all seen the images of semi-tractor trailer trucks careening out of control on the highways in the reporting of snowstorm conditions.  Maybe driverless AI trucking will cure that?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

It has been a few years since I did an on-site JA for a truck driver, but I recall from ergonomics and other training in the past that the force required just to pull one's own body weight up in order to enter most tractor-trailer rigs is at least at the Medium level. Federal regs say the following:

Distance between steps. The distance between steps, up to and including the door sill step, shall provide any person a stable resting position which can be sustained without body motion and by exerting no more arm force than 35 percent of the person's body weight per grasp during all stages of entry and exit. This criterion applies to intermediate positions as well as transition between intermediate positions above ground level.   

Find citation at: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-III/subchapter-B/part-399/subpart-L/section-399.207

Do the math with even a 150 pound driver (most drivers are probably heavier), and you already are at more than 50 pounds. 

I often hear drivers mention doing no-touch driving, but they still have to get into and out of the truck or climb on it to check or secure loads. Unless they have a special lift to access the cab or other areas of the truck that must be checked, they are exerting more than Light force. 

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

Ha!   I thought that this discussion was going a bit far as we started by discussing only hook and drop trucking. Now you raise the question of putting tire chains on the trucks in winter. I have seen that done. Yes, I think the ergonomic term for that task is "arduous". 😊

 

It is my understanding that many northern states have banned tire chains and cleats because they tear up the highways. It makes trucking so much more exciting in the winter snowstorms. We have all seen the images of semi-tractor trailer trucks careening out of control on the highways in the reporting of snowstorm conditions.  Maybe driverless AI trucking will cure that?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

It has been a few years since I did an on-site JA for a truck driver, but I recall from ergonomics and other training in the past that the force required just to pull one's own body weight up in order to enter most tractor-trailer rigs is at least at the Medium level. Federal regs say the following:

Distance between steps. The distance between steps, up to and including the door sill step, shall provide any person a stable resting position which can be sustained without body motion and by exerting no more arm force than 35 percent of the person's body weight per grasp during all stages of entry and exit. This criterion applies to intermediate positions as well as transition between intermediate positions above ground level.   

Find citation at: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-III/subchapter-B/part-399/subpart-L/section-399.207

Do the math with even a 150 pound driver (most drivers are probably heavier), and you already are at more than 50 pounds. 

I often hear drivers mention doing no-touch driving, but they still have to get into and out of the truck or climb on it to check or secure loads. Unless they have a special lift to access the cab or other areas of the truck that must be checked, they are exerting more than Light force. 

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!

When we get sufficient now in these here parts, even the USPS mail carriers chain up their delivery vehicles.

Ha!   I thought that this discussion was going a bit far as we started by discussing only hook and drop trucking. Now you raise the question of putting tire chains on the trucks in winter. I have seen that done. Yes, I think the ergonomic term for that task is "arduous". 😊

 

It is my understanding that many northern states have banned tire chains and cleats because they tear up the highways. It makes trucking so much more exciting in the winter snowstorms. We have all seen the images of semi-tractor trailer trucks careening out of control on the highways in the reporting of snowstorm conditions.  Maybe driverless AI trucking will cure that?

 

Best regards,

Jeff Barrett, M.Ed., CAP. CRC, CVE, CCM
Options Plus

optionsplusinc.com
954-929-9694


The contents of this e-mail message and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the addressee. The information contained herein may be privileged and confidential. If you have received this transmission in error, any use, reproduction or dissemination of this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please immediately notify the sender by e-mail reply, do not produce copies of this transmission or any attachments, and delete this message and its attachments, if any.

 

It has been a few years since I did an on-site JA for a truck driver, but I recall from ergonomics and other training in the past that the force required just to pull one's own body weight up in order to enter most tractor-trailer rigs is at least at the Medium level. Federal regs say the following:

Distance between steps. The distance between steps, up to and including the door sill step, shall provide any person a stable resting position which can be sustained without body motion and by exerting no more arm force than 35 percent of the person's body weight per grasp during all stages of entry and exit. This criterion applies to intermediate positions as well as transition between intermediate positions above ground level.   

Find citation at: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/subtitle-B/chapter-III/subchapter-B/part-399/subpart-L/section-399.207

Do the math with even a 150 pound driver (most drivers are probably heavier), and you already are at more than 50 pounds. 

I often hear drivers mention doing no-touch driving, but they still have to get into and out of the truck or climb on it to check or secure loads. Unless they have a special lift to access the cab or other areas of the truck that must be checked, they are exerting more than Light force. 

I began my vocational career placing truck drivers.  I can tell you that there are certainly no-touch loads.  I'm referring to not having to "unload" product.  Not saying these positions are sedentary, or even light, although some certainly are.  Here are some examples:

--anything tanker--liquid or gas--may be classified this way, although one must hook up hoses and sometimes climb to the top of the tank.  The force of pulling hoses is going to exceed sedentary certainly and in many cases light;

--palletized loads-these are what most in the industry refer to as no-touch.  They are not drop and hook, they are back up to the dock and the load is unloaded by forklift--usually an employee there on the dock, but occasionally by the truck driver themselves.  I think that is likely becoming less prevalent, due to the risk of having a non-employee operate such a piece of equipment;

--and finally, even if not palletized, there are others where the driver does not unload the truck--others do it.  Sometimes they are called "lumpers".  I recall one driver telling me about a unique experience transporting a Kosher load.  His hands were not allowed to touch the load, so it was certainly no-touch. The "lumpers" in this case were part of the religious order where the load when. He was told to stand back.  He did. 

While I worked there, the instructors took me out on the road and I drove a truck and I can tell you that it is certainly correct that operating foot controls and shifting a 15-speed transmission is identified as light.  It is not sedentary.  Some truck driver positions are sedentary.  They drive automatic transmissions, and the foot control involves little more than flexing one's foot, and they do not have to unload.  These are not reserved for the old-timers, even though they are coveted positions; it's just what the position entails.

Regarding the pulling of hoses, I have not measured that with a digital force meter, but I have measured the pulling of wire for an electrician position for an ADA job description.  I cannot recall the exact number of pounds of force required, but it definitely exceeded light.  I recall my partner and myself being surprised, but the electrician accompanying us was not. 

That is my experienced two cents. 

Good evening - in reply to the whole discussion, the ORS breaks things down differently than the DOT/RHAJ. So now the ORS has strength as one requirement, sitting as another, standing as another, push/pull with hand as another, etc.

So ... these differing requirements can all be put in the ORS employment calculator that I uploaded here (with updated versions) a while back, to estimate employment numbers within an occupation, using the BLS's published calculation methodology. I'll uploaded the calculator again (attached here). You can now estimate truck drivers, Sedentary with such and such push/pull, versus Light with such and such push/pull.

Going back to the original question, the ORS did not ask about "no touch" as an occupational requirement, so LMS seems to be the way to go. 

Morning All,

I'd love to hear from someone with familiarity with the trucking industry regarding the availability of true no-touch driving jobs.  Based on my research there certainly seems to be some growth in this area, particularly with the larger carriers.  I'd welcome any information.  Thanks!